@ SK: What is the difference between morals and ethics? Are morals made by each and every individual meaning his mind? It seems Kant brought out a theory of morality without bringing God into picuture. What is that theory?
Knol Educational Institute Channels
Knol can introduce the concept of Knol Educational Institute Channels and invite all institutes having channels on youtube to use Knol Platform as a complementary platform
Education Videos on YouTube
Education videos on youtube
Knol – A Unique ICT Resource for Faculty Members
A unique ict resource for faculty
The above idea results into type of knols that knol authors, especially the faculty members can create.
How to Manage the Older Workers – Suggestions For Younger Supervisors Videobased knols can be created. Videos are selected from the youtube educational channels. That way the channels get additional visitors through knol and the knol author can write his commentary and add more resources for understanding the topic. The learning community can also contribute commentaries and resources. It will be really interesting exercise. We will try out this technique in the next course at NITIE.
SK @ KVSS
Please read my latest knol: “He wished to insist on the authority of science and yet preserve the authority of morals”
@ SK Happy to note that you are well versed with Kant’s idea. Will be interesting if you write a separate knol on ideas developed by Kant and extensions done by others to it so far. Then where is the shortcoming still and how you are completing the argument.
There is always a problem that others do not agree to our ideas because they are not their ideas. But we can simultaneously see many new faces in any discipline. So there is a willingness to listen to others and recognize others’ contributions.
I read in Telugu novel’s preface the difference between a scientist and a promoter. Even a scientist in promoter’s role behaves in a different way. A promoter or a supporter is in a hurry and also he is a steadfast in his idea. I am a knol supporter. So I keep identifying more and more positive things of knol.
Scientists are highly sceptical and present their arguments in a sequence and wait for the reactions of others as and when they come. Of course they can do further theory building on their own without waiting for the confirmation of others. They may apply within their circle of influence also for practical use. But inventors do not wait. They want glory for their invention and business for their invention as early as possible. Many times invention is not science. Invention can be verified more quickly. You say the item will do something. It does or it does not. Many inventors’ items do not work when they publicly demonstrate them. It is ok, they go back.
Your trying to blame others repeatedly has to no use. Of course when somebody comes opposite to you and blames you for something, you are going to reply to him. Otherwise your blaming science and scientists repeatedly is counter productive for your mission of making more people aware of some idea which you think will work for their good. But if you think you will succeed only by repeatedly blaming some people, you can do it. May be ends justify means. Some ethical support may be for it.
SK @ KVSS
Thank you for your feedback. I have converted this post into the knol:
SKS @ ALL
Spread the word: Knol will be fine. Stop complaining. Start participating!
Great Message SKS
Complain the Japanese Way. Write more. Presently we are having around750 new knols on many days. Looking for a day when that number crosses 1000 first and then 1500. Not very difficult. 1500 authors have to write one knol a day. We have around 50,000 authors. Each has to write one a month. But all have to be active. For that they need to be recognized by coauthors.
Please write at least one comment on new authors’ knols. They will feel welcome on the platform. First acknowledge them, then encourage them and then suggest improvements.
read-heard-viewed-thought-by-kvss-nrao: Desperate Desire to Share Stories and Ideas I read so much and I found so much. So desperate to share. I stil read a lot and think a lot. So desperate to share.
SK @ SKS
Knol will be fine I agree but knol can be finer! Knol management expected to see knols providing original knowledge to expand the frontiers of science. But knol mostly turned out to be another poorer version of Wikipedia. Google waited patiently to see if knol would improve but they were disappointed. Google saw the potential of Wikipedia to mankind and so gave 10 million to Wikipedia. As for knol they are not that impressed and as a result they withdrew even the 20 people they had assigned for knol help.
It is still not to late; if only we can bring up the quality; focus on expanding the frontiers of knowledge and instead of forming closed groups and fighting amongst ourselves, if we work together then Google is ready to invest more than 10 million on the knol platform. We should all come together and form a joint task force to take knol to great heights. As of now knol is not a priority for Google; it is considered a so-so success! And as a business venture it is a failure for them and as you know the bottom line for any company is profits…
Innovations in Education on the Net – Edyounet – Knol – Wikipedia
Withdrawal of 20 persons from knol team is a part of austerity measures initiated by Google in response to recession. They may not have reinstated a good team for Knol so far. But that is not affecting authors in a significant way. We are still able to write and publish articles. This is good. If Google can spend less money but Knol continues to grow, Google would like it. They will enter when they feel like scaling the platform in a big way. Knol has knowledge from research papers to alphabets of languages. As an open knowledge platform, it has provided scope and opportunity to everybody. Regarding arguments and fights among authors they are common on many platforms and on other platforms they are more closely controlled. On Knol there was no control. But as Knol grows and people realize that they have to perform on their individual efforts and arguments do not benefit in any way, these conflicts fade away.
Authors have to concentrate on writing and promoting their articles. No body will promote your articles unless you promote them first. Then others may chip in and it may add to your effort if many like your articles and lend a helping hand.
I saw today somebody tweeting my article on Google’s Social Media Evolution. Those things are bonus to an author.
SKS made the right call: Keep Participating. Knol will be fine. Stop Complaining. Keep Writing. Keep Editing.
Spread the word. Knol is an innovation in Wiki space. It is a unique resource for educational institutions. They have to start channels on knol like they did on Youtube.
My latest knols: Free Will
The absolutely essential necessity of a wise world.
Expectation from authors and authors’ performanceKnol Performance Framework and Review.
An appeal to fellow Knol Authors Promote Knol in Social Media
It is profitable to write negatively about Google products in social media. I realized it after my serious involvement in Knol. I am trying to highlight it in various knols. See the knol Google Buzz – Buzz in Favor of Google Buzz for articles dealing with this negative bias and how social media is writing negative things about Buzz. There are some Google Fans trying their best to promote Buzz and defend it. Chris Lang is a die-hard supporter of Google, it seems. We, knol authors have to build connection with them and make a common cause to promote Knol and Buzz and other Google products. We need to use buzz more and join such persons. I find there is no interesting article about Google Buzz on knol. One of us who knows more about Buzz has to come out with a knol on it.
Made two comments on two topics on Buzz. Got responses also. May be knol authors can use Buzz more actively and find Google supporters and work with them to promote knol. It is clear now that we need to have strategy to do some thing in social media as a group of people. We do not have at the moment a person like Chris Lang to promote Knol in social media. We need media savvy person to take up that role on behalf of knol and he must be an active knol author also.
Happy to inform that Google Buzz – Buzz in Favor of Google Buzz has 110 page views so far. If some of you add some more material to it from your knowledge and experience and modify it to be a better piece, it will attract more visitors and help in promoting Buzz as well as knol.
KS @ SK
found this :
all the perplexities, confusion, and distress in America arises not from the defects of the constitution or confederation, not from want of honor or virtue, so much as from downright ignorance of the nature of coin, credit and circulation .
now, how can we explain money?
have we go back to Adam and Eve?
they were happy (unhappy) without money .
but already the wise Salomon said :
.. money is what has a reply in everything .
because all the things have a reply in language and money is what has a reply in everything, it closes the circuit between things and language.
therefore we also speak of monetary circulation of the economy (comparable with the blood circulation system of our body).
btw.(profound) money interest and cancerous ulcer are comparable (both grow usury).
now my personal observation was, that money has to do something with write down (see the clay tablets in ancient babylon and the name “zettel” (note) for bank notes).
one has (in addition to money (gold, etc.) as general diving medium) just written down what someone has given to the other,
and that’s also the basis of whuffie system .
the sense is that banks with their promissory note and interest-rate system be abolished and to make all of us little bankers (everyone has the right to create about 300 w from nowhere (in bank jargon also called money-added or money called ).
SK @ KS
Yes indeed ignorance of the fundamentals of money is a big factor in the current economic mess in America and the world. But this is not the only factor. The bigger factor in America is this over confidence in our ability to buy now and pay later. The arrogance of big corporations to push for more and more credit and more and more consumption of goods has finally come home to roost. Yes money has a reply for everything till the foundations of the financial system are good, look what happens when the sound financial principles are abandoned as in Zimbabwe. I am scared for America and the world that ultimately reality will catch up with the dollar if our government keeps printing dollars. Already some countries are complaining that we buy their goods and services which they create with diminishing resources and hard labor merely by printing money. The are many reasons why the US dollar is still mighty but reality works like this:Money–money–money–money–money–money–money. Say Money is the sound currency and as we go along the value keeps going down till it reaches and changes to money.
Money was created to ease the barter system. Money changes hands for actual goods and services. In the case of our Whuffie who will monitor when someone has used up his 300 W and is not making extra Ws? When everyone creates money what will be its value? What will happen when this 300 runs out for individuals, will we not have to go back to the old system? More important how and who will determine which country has the right to how much Ws. We have to be very clear about all these factors before anything can be done. But you do have a good goal that needs further development so work to take out all the glitches.
There was a very interesting Larry King interview yesterday with four leading brain scientists. I was hoping that Larry will ask what is the difference between brain and mind but he didn’t.
An open letter to Mr. Larry King and CNN
The combination of brain and mind as a compound unit produces consciousness. An engine which has many parts produces power for the vehicle. Suppose we have a problem in the engine of a car, the problem must lie in some particular part and so unless we know which part needs repairing we cannot fix the engine.
Similarly as of today we do not have a good idea of the differences between brain and mind and so we do not have a clearly defined way of fixing the consciousness problem. This knowledge gap has rippling effects on all aspects of life for individuals, groups and countries. It has a direct result on such things as understanding of the self, mind, brain, and consciousness. This ignorance is reflected in how we create education, how we live our life, and it effects/affects everything from life to foreign policy. No wonder our understanding of the mind is so fuzzy that we do not have ‘mind’ as a topic in High School.
whether knol or google-buzz, social medium means that we have to tell google what to do, not the other way .
if this is guaranteed, I do not care where I write . it’s then not a google problem, it’s a community problem .
@ SK : glitches
1. how and who will determine which country has the right to how much Ws ?
the only country on knol is knol . we have determined that everyone has the right to make 300 w .
2. who will monitor when someone has used up his 300 W and is not making extra Ws?
in the first time we will do that . later on a knol programme can do .
3. what will happen when this 300 runs out for individuals ?
knol money group will make them an offer how they can earn more whuffie . we can make an auction, where everybody can double his whuffie.
I can make a knol for this (done) .
SKS @ SK
– The main problem is that many people see a state as its economy and that is not correct. Countries are not their economies only!
– Larry did not ask for the difference between brain and mind because simply people today think they know based on the most popular dogma of our time: materialism. Why ask, when they “know”?
SK @ SKS
I agree with you that materialism is all that matters to most people. But what I am trying to point out is that this is a direct result of a lack of emotional intelligence education. The monster in the lives of individuals, groups and countries is the self image. In Africa, in Asia, in all corners of the world it is the -2, -1 and +1 self image which keeps the real self captive and dictates its own agenda. In our so called developed countries our minds are not fully developed! We develop our minds to the +1 level thus projecting trophy self images. What do you expect from a trophy self image? All it wants is more and more trophies to satisfy its limitless hungers and for this it needs more and more money. So whole societies live for the creed of materialism! And the only thing that impresses them is bigger and better trophies. From trophy spouses to trophy everything else.
Simple promotion methods used by an online writer to get impressive performance.
Earning by Writing Knols through Adsense
How to Get 100,000 visitors per Month to Articles, Blogs, Knols – Let us Learn from the Experienced
We are mentioning these frequently. But I myself not using them regularly. A small number of authors use them half-heartedly. Result – no performance at individual level or platform level. I hope at least a 1000 authors take up similar effort regularly for each of their good knols at least.
SK @ Team
We can also blog on CNN:
“You Say ‘They Don’t Get Us’” – Larry King Live – CNN.com Blogs
Sep 17, 2010 … ‘The brain is the engine, while the car is the physical body of the human being where the mind is the driver of this car of life.’ …
I dont understand this .did larry king use this metaphors ?
My latest knol: I have found a way where we can fully accomplish the goals of emotional intelligence education without the need to de…
KVSS @ SK
Have you sent a twitter message. Have you integrated your twitter account with Buzz?
‘The brain is the engine, while the car is the physical body of the human being where the mind is the driver of this car of life.’
Brain is the engine. It creates the impulses that travel through nerves and make other parts function. The entire body is the car. Mind is the software that resides in the brain. This mind is full of ideas acquired by a human being with his own experience and put into a human being by others. The analogy looks appropriate.
Talking about similar things for a long time. But today I made one
Featured Knols – Selection by KVSSNRao
Each knol author can make one – a selection of knols that he wants to present to visitors. These lists can be changed often. It is a trending knol of today. 100 page views in a day.
My best knol yet I have decided to post on Larry King’s CNN blog.
Is President Obama a Muslim?Determining President Obama ’a faith in the context of the differences in the human brain and mind’.
Yesterday I went to a NY Times business summit and took 50, 4 page fliers of knols and gave them all out. I met people from the NY Times and many business leaders. Like Jerry, founder of Ben & Jerry’s ice cream. More interesting I met and shared my work with the founders of Yelp and Meetup.com These two web sites are also growing very fast. Meetup/everywhere is very good to start movements. 50,000 meetings are going on around the world at any given time thanks to meetup. This is ideal for Wisdom Day. A few of the people have promised to look into working with us. One of the people I bonded to is Malcolm Arnold founder of Ruby Nuby; Check it out at meetup.com/ruby-nuby-info/ One very good resource for small business is www.smallbiztrends.com You can have your own internet TV show on hotspot.tv; Another good resource is eleveninstitute.com and nytech.org. The chief lesson I came with is to get your message out there in all the current resources out there. Exactly what KVSS has been telling us. Use Utube, Facebook, hotspot.tv, Yelp, meetup.com, also a good place to get feedback about your website is through websitegrader.org. The next biggest lesson is to try and try till you have created a viral video message that spreads like a virus! Make it so clicking that it is shared by everyone on multiple platforms. It was mostly about how we are not using all the free resources available on the internet.
Wisdom Day was planned for 2nd of October. But I have not made any preparations. I am going to explore if meetup can speedup things other wise we have to postpone wisdom day.
This is the latest Time magazine cover issue. (October 4)
How the First Nine Months Shape the Rest of Your Life
By Annie Murphy Paul
Cancer. Heart disease. Obesity. Depression. The new science of fetal origins traces adult health to our experience in the womb.
Much of what is being said now I have been saying for over 35+ years. However science has still not come up to my level yet. Science is now tracing physical and emotional illnesses to the fetus stage, on a mass scale.There is still a big problem with medical research, they will research the disease, find a cure and move on, they must keep researching how to make a healthy person super healthy and not just an ill person healthy (it is now happening to some extent in recent years.) Especially in emotional diseases science must wake up to the fact,that finding a cure for making normal from subnormal is also mostly the cure for making normal into super normal.
Science must also move on from researching and tracing illnesses to the womb, what it is mostly now doing; to also researching the effects of positive emotional feedback from the womb onwards. I have built my hypothesis on the happy experiences that the fetus has and what this constant positive feed back does to the emotional health of the fetus, how it shapes the brain and the mind of the fetus, of the child and later in life of the adult. One day soon actual science will proclaim my hypothesis of womb-conditioning as a factual fact. I hope it happens in my life time.
Read more: http://www.time.com/time/health?iid=redirect-science#ixzz14gd5vQuf
I am doing a survey. In the first instance the question was posted to all centurion knollers. I got five or six replies so far. Some of you also must have seen my comment on your pages. Looking forward to your replies and then will consolidate them and then present the findings. We need to act according to opinions of many people.
Are you happy with number of your knols and page views – A Survey.
You are a centurion knoller – A very active knol author
Saw today that good number of authors have posted more than 1000 knols. Good for Knol.
Many of these concept knols are having 500 and more page views. That shows the utility of these knol articles.You create these articles when you feel there is need for them and over a period of time people will see them when want some clarification. We have a section of authors, who feel, they will update their knol everyday and thereby they will be on the home page of knol every day and get page views. We appreciate their strategy. But that is not the only strategy to attract visitors to your articles. There are multiple ways and authors are free to choose their ways. Be patient with the authors. Encourage them to contribute and support them and inform them your ways. But do not insist that your way is the only way. There are many successful authors and each has his own way of going about. Give knol authors the liberty and freedom to choose their own path. Google believes in open platforms and identifying the right fit through its search algorithms.
Joined today WikAnswers site. Answered two questions. It is good if knol authors join this site and give answers to various questions. You provide some guidance to people and also link your detailed knols to the answers.
I posted my 3000th serial numbered post today.
How to Get 100,000 visitors per Month to Articles, Blogs, Knols – Let us Learn from the Experienced
KVSS @ KS and SK
In India, there are certain traditions.
A bride and bridegroom are treated with respect from the time they are formally declared as one till 16 days of after marriage. They are treated as Gods during this period after marriage. Similarly once a lady becomes pregnant, she is provided all the comforts and good things in life. All her wishes regarding eating are fulfilled. So realization that pregnant ladies have to be kept happy is an age old realization. Of course, every good practice needs reiteration. One has to keep mother happy, sisters happy, wife happy, daughters happy is part of Hindu religious doctrine and rituals. In practice what is happening is open for all to see. So the ideas can be improved, systems can be improved and rituals can be improved. But do not talk and write as if they did not exist.
When i was in my teens there was a huge flood in my town of Lucknow. Sheesh Mahal, my house was on high ground but it was surrounded with water. The cook said that there was just meat for lunch. I was sitting at one of the doors watching the water flow by. I saw some raw mangoes floating by. With a stick I was able to pluck some. I gave them to the cook to add to the meat. I remember the dish turned out tasty. Another time I plucked from the flowing water a huge raw papaya. Again I got that cooked. It tasted fabulous. You must try these sometime, as vegetables. Also it is amazing that in India we eat the water melon and through away the skin and the green part. Then we go to the market and buy pumpkin to cook for food. Even the poor families who can hardly afford it; do this. Actually the skin and green part of the water melon tastes similar to the pumpkin. By eating the red part as fruit and the green part as vegetable we can save money. Someone should twitter this information.
@ KVSS & KS : SK (9/25)1
And making individuals, groups and countries wise should now be a top priority! Because it can be done in a clear cut manner.
So the concepts are already there from the ancient times; I just made them clear and took out most of the fuzziness!
Here is how I am bringing the main philosophy debate into the territory of a science debate: By proposing my hypothesis that wisdom is a fragrance of the brain we can now re-frame the mysterious intangibles like the mind, self, consciousness and emotional intelligence in the context of the very tangible brain. Thus we can research ways to see if changing the tangible brain’s emotional intelligence at the subconscious and unconscious levels, brings about a change in these intangibles that are projected by the brain.
Taking advantage of the fact that (what I call) wisdom is an ‘all’ entity which means all the attributes of wisdom have the same exact characteristics as wisdom and have all the attributes of wisdom. For instance love at +2 will also have selflessness, humility, respect, awe, honesty… You cannot have one without having all the other attributes of wisdom. Love cannot be an independent attribute devoid of dignity, respect, trust, sacrifice etc. So if we can find one attribute of wisdom that is easier to know, understand, define and teach then we can take this attribute and define, know and understand this attribute so that we can teach just this attribute. Selflessness is one such attribute of wisdom. It is a fundamental quality of wisdom just as all the other qualities of wisdom. Selflessness is very easy to define. Selflessness is the complete absence of id and ego and selflessness is also one’s super mature conscience.
I have absorbed, researched, cross-referenced, chewed, digested and put under the microscope so often the insights of all these immortals that I have now created my own self created knowledge! In fact I have created my own microscope that separates the emotions coming from the self, the self image, the brain, the mind, id, ego, super ego etc. so I make it easy to fix the defects of the self. I am standing on the shoulders of all these giants.
Appreciate SK’s Youtube videos promoting his thoughts on wisdom as well as Knol.
Fellow Knol Author Sajid Ali Khan’s YouTube Videos
I sincerely appreciate your effort. You did it in 2008 itself. We did not recognize it so far.
SK @ KVSS
There is an education conference going on in New York. I came to know too late today. It is also on the net. It is educationnation.com. You can participate in it on the web. It will last a week. I will go there tommrow.
You can make a knol of our conversation if you want.
KS @ SK
done . it’s part of the collection board themes
I deleted the contents here .
did you delete my post :
your religion is welcome on knol .
but if your gods only want tell us what we have to do, nobody will listen to them .
they first should learn what democracy means 😉 .
can you tell me why ?
SK @ KS
I did not delete any post. Neither should you; even if you put it all in a new knol. It will get lost in the new knol. Here at least more people will read it. Please post it back.
KS 2 SK
are you kidding ?
2010-08-08 you wrote :
This bulletin board should be only for policy differences, we should open another knol for all personal tiffs. This new knol should be for members only. Airing our differences here makes us look like a bunch of puffed up self images. As a team we are still strong.
do you really want the team to read all this personal tiffs ? RK surely will not.
btw. they have already read it . (look at the page views) .
and after a week all the content is lost in the archive (we had this already) .
if there is a board theme for it, then you only need two clicks to get it (if you want to read it) .
as to my post I now know who has deleted it . but why ?
SK @ KS
Legitimate dialouge is not personal tiffs. When you say,
‘your religion is welcome on knol . but if your gods only want tell us what we have to do, nobody will listen to them .’
It is a legitimate post. Untill you realize my response, ‘That all the gods Western and Eastern are all saying the same thing: Accquire Wisdom!
Happy Birthday Google
Happy Birthday – 27th September – Prosperity to All – Promoter, Shareholders, Employees, Associates
KS 2 SK
personal tiffs :
you wrote : “this is your old tactic/problem; instead of answering specifics you shift to generalities.”
look what you have done : instead of answering specifics you shift to generalities .
this is your old tactic/problem : you are full of contradictions .
you say : “It is a legitimate post. Untill you realize my response”
whatever that means (perhaps it means :”ifyou realize my response”), it was you who did not realize my response .
my response was that wisdom is older than your gods : “it tells us that the time before religion was the paradise . there was no father, no king, no god”
I have managed to post a few blogs on educationnation.com which is the most important education policy forum in the US today, perhaps the world. Even President Obama is participating in it! I have posted my comments directly on his blog! Lets see how it goes. You all can also post your ideas on education reform on this foremost site on education and its future.
Happy to share with you recent performance records.
48,567 page views/month. May be tomorrow it will cross 49,000.
Today new knols written were 891 – highest number that I saw so far in the last six months say. Would be good if the figure goes up to 1500. Looking forward to some competition from Google/Knol in some language.
the “spirit world” and “religion” are two completely different things.
the “spirit world” is what “is”, “religion” is what we “imagine” it to be.
the “physical world” and “science” are two completely different things.
the “physical world” is what “is”, “science” is what we “imagine” it to be…
The Spirit World and the Physical World are unassailable Cosmic Realities…
Religion and Science were created by men, so are riddled with flaws and mistakes…
spirit world, physical world by Seeger Carbalal
SK @ Team
Bill Gates is spending 500 million dollars over the next three years to seek an answer to the question what constitutes a good teacher. I think our next topic for the knol contest should be: What are the qualities of a good teacher. I am sure anyone who can best answer this question can expect some good reward from the Bill Gates Foundation. So each one of us should start a knol, ‘The qualaties that make a great teacher’ and keep researching and improving it. I will try to submit all the knols on this topic that we write to the Bill Gates Foundation.
The good thing that happened with this educationnation summit is that one of the main organizers of this summit is now well aware of my work. I think she likes my work as she read my flier on my work and was extremely nice to me.
The human mind works in images. We do not perceive reality, we see its image. That is the difference between us humans and Gd. Gd is reality, He just is; while we even though are real; we still do not know our real self.
Developing Active Knol Authors and Knols Posted. Request you all to become coauthors and contribute.
Request all authors to add their names in the appropriate section. We will have better interaction and will be able to interact better.
My knol page views are still in increasing trend. Tomorrow they will come close to 50,000 monthly page views. I shall try to promote my knols this year better through social book marking and twitter. Let me see what will be the benefit. Stopping writing knols to a large extent will give me time to relax and recover some health. I am trying to record the peaks in page views in:
Knol Page Views and Visitors – Historical Record – K.V.S.S. Narayana Rao
I am sure many more knol authors are also having increase in page views. It will be good if they publicly declare the increased performance. There will be more energy and excitement on the platform. More new authors will join and write knols.
A-auction was closed today .
tomorrow B-auction will start .
request you all to become co-owners and contribute.
request all authors to add their names in the appropriate section. we will have better whuffie interaction and will be able to interact better on knol money group .
if your story about Bill Gates is true, then it shows that he is a very good teacher .
your idea to make a knol contest with this topic is also very good .
we can use kaf-author-writing-contest for this (we can archive the original contents and link to it)
we can give W300, W200, and W100 as prizes .
knol money group can buy whuffie for this .
This is not a story, it is true. I came to know through a very senior NBC official.
The Governor of New York State is taking a delegation of business leaders to New Delhi and Mumbai from November 11th to November 14. I have been invited to come. I may come, if I do, I will let you know. I will stay on after the 14th for a couple of days.
.< board 2010